Should Canada have a guaranteed annual income?
Does it make economic sense to provide each Canadian with a guaranteed annual income?
Sure, the question sounds like the latest topic from the Saint Ignatius debating club, but many analysts believe that the answer is yes, according to the Globe and Mail.
This week, a House of Commons committee on poverty released a report proposing a guaranteed basic income for Canadians with disabilities, on the model already available to seniors. Earlier this year, a similar report outlined how such a scheme would work for all low-income Canadians.
It has been tested with success in other countries, and now it has re-entered the Canadian political conversation.
Conservative Senator Hugh Segal, one of the more vocal proponents of no-strings-attached aid for the poor, argues that giving money with no conditions removes the stigma and shame around poverty, allowing people to focus instead on how to improve their lot.
Requiring the poor to prove continually that they are deserving of assistance or threatening to cut benefits without notice only discourages the risk-taking and confidence required to get out of poverty, he says.
Part of what's holding back a guaranteed annual income is perception and language. People don't like the idea of entitlement, when they hear guarantees they think of rights without responsibilities.
Even a more scaled-back GAI proposal that just replaced social assistance at a provincial level might still be very expensive, admits UBC economist Kevin Milligan.
Having a transfer large enough to satisfy those worried about the wellbeing of the very poor, and also a clawback rate small enough to satisfy those concerned about work incentives, might yield a very expensive policy.
Make sense to you? Or is a guaranteed income program just another misplaced Robin Hood policy?
By Gordon Powers, MSN Money
Posted by: Bracken | Nov 23, 2021 10:26:22 AM
Guaranteed annual income is a good idea, it removes stigma, gives poor people back their dignity, improves their chances of having good health and gives them an opportunity for personal growth and self-reliance. It’s time for change...the programs now in place have not, and will not lift people out of poverty, it just keeps them stuck there at the bottom, unvalued and discriminated.
Posted by: Joel | Nov 23, 2021 10:39:11 AM
I have been on social assistance for almost 2 years now and I never get anywhere, they just keep putting me on these useless programs that i never finish or that do not benefit me with a career or education. I spent 7 months doing my GED i passed 4 out of the 5 tests and in order to retake my 1 test i failed I need to redu the coarse. so now I'm in weable (an adult credit school) doing my grade 11 math that i need to get into Computer system technician course in Fanshawe College. So if I could have been in college by now, if i didn't waist 7 month getting my GED.
I am hoping they come up with a plan were low income earners get a government cheque each month to spend it on themselves so they can guide their own lives instead of the government doing it for them.
Posted by: WillyD | Nov 23, 2021 10:55:45 AM
Honestly, I think there should be a stigma and conditions attached to free taxpayer money. That being said, the amount of money wasted on administering 20 different social program cheques outways the downside in my opinion. Give the money to the poor, and hopefully 50% or the recipients will make something of themselves and live without the stress of where the next cheque is coming from until they get thier live back together.
I would also make this a federal program, and include everything under this umbrella(CPP, EI, OAS, Welfare, Disability, GIS, etc.) and demand that tax reurns be filed so that fraud is eliminated.
Posted by: Noel | Nov 23, 2021 11:04:29 AM
NO. You want a guaranteed income get a job. For the people with disabilities I do not have a problem with it. For able bodied people do what you need to do, and get a job and contribute to the world around you. Man this is just silly seems like one step closer to communism or being a truly socialist state.
Joel, maybe if you think you're wasting your time or that they don't benefit you then that reflects in your studies and why you never passed your GED. And why is it the governments fault that you never finish any of these training programs? Was it english that you need improvement on? Waist? Redu? Coarse? about a dozen "i", Also I'm prety sure you need your GED to get into college in the first place as well. lol.
Posted by: susan schuurman | Nov 23, 2021 11:06:09 AM
Yes, I think they should try it. Food and basic shelter are expensive. I think it could keep people away from crime too and give people some dignity. It could also be good for the economy by providing better cash flow among more people. In the end, a buck is a buck.
Posted by: brad | Nov 23, 2021 11:09:44 AM
When do all the hand outs end? I would be fine with someone getting a base wage if it was some sort of top up program but then why not just increase minimum wage?
I worked through high school to save for college and I worked full time through college to pay all my bills I lived off a diet of rice and hotdogs b/c that’s all I could afford. I had zero help and had to do everything for myself.
I’ve worked my A#@ off for the last 10 years after college to get to a comfortable point financially. When will people start taking responsibility for their own life? Look at our economy, the hand out’s can’t keep going on like this. We are already taxed to death and our health system is falling apart. Let’s start putting money in areas that benefit the middle class tax payers and stop rewarding everyone for doing nothing.
Joel they gave you a change to get your GED you blew it. As far as I’m concerned you shouldn’t get any more help and I’m surprised that you would even whine about it.
Posted by: sahm | Nov 23, 2021 11:23:54 AM
Frankly if the government wants to give someone a guaranteed income how about stay at home mom's who work 365 days a year, 24/7! We are considered unemployed by the government and everyone else but we work harder than the average person and get no sick time, benefits etc. I worked 4 jobs at a time to put myself through university and worked hard to make a living as an early childhood educator, if people want an income they know how to get it, get a job! And if you are getting help from the government than you should bust your a** and make something of it instead of living off of taxpayers money.
Posted by: Noel and Brad | Nov 23, 2021 11:27:28 AM
O'wisest Noel & Superior Brad,
With regards to Joel, see below:
“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.” ~ Paulo Coelho
I assumed both of you have your PhDs.
James
Posted by: Myles | Nov 23, 2021 11:28:09 AM
Peak Oil, Economic Collapse are a Fraud
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=0A368F445D0AA63A
make no mistake the new laws go after the people growing their own food, medicine, while letting the big mafia run and control the drug market, while adding toxic substances to the drugs at the same time. double speak: government says synthetic thc is good for you;but the natural plant is bad;Cannabis hemp provides biodegradable fuel, plastic, fibre, the most nutritional seed on the planet, medicine that cures even cancer. time to take our countries back by making cannabis, therefore food, fuel, fibre abundant. The big oil companies lobbied government to make cannabis illegal all over the world to allow for the big oil companies to poison the earth and make profit. end this madness before my comment is censored.
Posted by: James | Nov 23, 2021 11:32:20 AM
O'wisest Noel & Superior Brad,
With regards to Joel, see below:
“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.” ~ Paulo Coelho
I assumed both of you have your PhDs.
Kind regards,
James
Posted by: unknown | Nov 23, 2021 11:46:34 AM
I would agree to some sort of control in a person's income especially when private companies out there are robbering their employee and filling their own pockets. My husband has been working for 35 years straight and for the last 10 years was never given a pay increase while the owners buy themselves new homes, cars and lavish spend on family celebrations. Can the government not question these situations by looking into their finance during audits? Imagine living 10 years without a pay increase while all of your billings are going up daily. I myself worked for 30 years straight and the last company worked for, due to lavish personnal spending they had to restructure the company to save money which means layoff and I was one of them. How do one find justice in situations like this? Unemployment payout should be based on your last full earnings and not on a minimum. Limiting payment means limiting sending. The media will soon have no influence on people because we will all soon realize that we are being USED.
Posted by: Anna-Marie Mullin | Nov 23, 2021 11:55:09 AM
I agree with sahm, where is the compensation for mothers who stay home and look after their children. Just think if all mothers could stay at home raising their children knowing that they have an income to do that, there would be less need of daycares and the money that is filtered into them by the government could be applied to these stay at home mothers. I don't know about you but when I was raising my daughters, I had to work and believe me I wanted to be the one to see my children first thing in the morning, instead of slipping into their rooms at 6:00 every morning kiss them goodbye and go off to work, leaving them with a babysitter all day. I was fortunate enough to have 6 years home with them but I still misssed out on so much. The government is in our pockets constantly taxing us to death and beyond, isn't it about time they got out of our pockets. If everyone had a base salary given to them ( like in one of the Scandanavian countries) and if they are working that is clawed back, but this way everyone would be registered and have to pay income tax. We are taxed to such an extent in this country from property, ourselves, goods and services and what do we get back for this ----well we all know the answer to that one more taxes.
Right now the percentage of people who work under the table and don't pay taxes is very high, if these people got a base salary they would at least have to pay income taxes on that money. I have never been on welfare, I ask the question do they pay income tax on this money. If they don't, they would have to under the base salary system. I should think that would be a more accurate accounting on the income tax system. I had to struggle and pay for every university/college course I have ever taken, but again I consider myself fortunate that I had people to help me, so I am not going to look down on someone who can't or won't advance themselves. I have not walked a mile in their shoes, but I was a young mother once upon a time and I know what it feels like to have someone else raise your child. I didn't like it, not one bit but I had to do it to survive. Mothers are not credited in this country like they should be.
Posted by: brad | Nov 23, 2021 12:01:19 PM
Smart A@s James,
I never said my path is the only way or the best way, in hind sight I would have done things differently.
I don't have my PhD but I have my Masters in Business which I got on my own while working a full time job. When my business has been hiring for the last 12 month and still can find enough people to fill the jobs because it's hard work (and at $20/hour it’s not a bad wage), so I don't have a lot of sympathy for people sitting on social assistance.
Go to Fort Mac they are always looking for workers and you could probably pick up a trade while you’re up there.
I think the real issue lies with Gen X, which I’m a part of, we seem to have a since of entitlement. We want everything but don’t want to work for it like our parents did. It might be tough love and I may sound like a bit of a jerk saying it but I think that’s what our economy needs. There is always going to be people that need a helping hand and I’m fine with that however social assistance is just that assistance. It’s not a way of life! Most of all its temporary!
Posted by: Mike | Nov 23, 2021 12:11:19 PM
If the government or some other entity wants to set up a VOLUNTARY donation program (or charity) where the money would go to society's poorest, I'd have no problem with that. But by what right should the government take from those who work to earn more than the "bare minimum"?
Posted by: jorgy | Nov 23, 2021 12:18:54 PM
Think there has to be some set of criteria not just carte blanche becouse a certain percentage would still be hoped becouse there life is based on bad decisions becouse all we would be doing is enabling them. Hows this for an example my sister works for social services makes almost 50g a year and still has to ask my mom for gas money to visit her. I love my sister but she has been enabled all her life. She would live cheque to cheque whether she made 18g a yr on welfare or 80g she just spend more on bad habits.
And she works for social sevices and tells me stories of how people get there cheque at begging of month and there back 3 days later asking for more becouse they drank or gambled it away and the government cuts them another cheque. Think people you have to take responsibilty for your own life. We have safety nets in place already and I don't want my tax money enabling anyone. You should be motovated by being embarresed of needing social assistance.
I had nothing graduating from high school as my parents divorved and declared bankruptcy at that time. Worked Went to college on a student loan that I paid off Always lived within my means. Now I travel the world have a net worth of close to half a million. But I chose that path could have just as easily gave up and felt sorry for myself having to ride the bus and driving reallly clunky cars and eating kd and hot dogs in my early 20's. So What I am saying if your able bodied and have any pride it's not hard to do. As far as disabled people thats another story and yes don't mind helping them out.
Posted by: Saffera | Nov 23, 2021 12:23:53 PM
I say I must agree with Brad. I'm sure everyone has a sob story out there but it's what you do to get your life back in order, starting with getting a job. There are so many jobs out there, people have to put their pride aside and work at whatever job they need to so that they can support themself and their family.
Posted by: Len | Nov 23, 2021 12:30:15 PM
I agree with basic guaranteed income for EVERYONE either 60 years old or truly disabled but the disabled income stops when CPP and OAP funds kick in for the disabled person.
Posted by: James | Nov 23, 2021 12:54:05 PM
Dear Brad,
It came like no surprise to me, the manner in which you responded to my posting.
I must comment on your salutions, coming from a person with a MASTERS IN BUSINESS, it was very immature.
One key important thing to know in life; that someone's life can change easily due to a severals factors such as Economic, Financial, and Social.
Take for example the World Financial Crisis, several top level managers in the financial company, where I am presently employed, lost their jobs.
There is one in particular, who was the bread winner, end up with a huge mortgage and large amounts of outstanding bills. After six (6) months, unable to gain meaninful employment, after the financial crisis, her husband divorced her.
The lady got discouraged, and declared bankruptcy - the bank took possession of his assets and thus offset her liabilities.
The lady had a nervous breakdown, and became an alcoholic. At present, she is in rehab, trying to get over her alcoholism, currently resides in Ontario Housing.
And it caused me to wonder, how life is, one time - she was the highly vibrant - leader of a dept. Just one (1) change caused may ripples in that person's life.
Kind regards,
James
Posted by: Hugh G | Nov 23, 2021 12:57:50 PM
As a person with a severe disabilty trying to live off the $6000 & some dollars a year I recieve from Canada Pension Disability cheque, I can say it's impossible without a lot of help from the kindness of family. And I'm not getting any younger & my dad who I've lived with for many years now is getting on in years..where do I go? Who cares? I'm just a burden on the working people. Taking and not giving back @ least that seems to be how many feel about people in situations like mine. I'm not on welfare & haven't asked for it to this day.
Would it help me to get an increase in my monthly cheque, of course. $500 + dollars a month can only go so far, try it for a couple of years. I didn't ask for this disability but yet by some I'm judged to be lazy & taking from hard working people. I paid into EI, CPP etc just like most. Almost every purchase I make is taxed. Given the dollars I make to taxes I pay on goods etc ratio, in my province that's a lot taken from my income.
Anyway, the odds of disabled people that cannot work receiving a guaranteed income is as likely as summer coming to Canada in January.
Posted by: Bonnie | Nov 23, 2021 1:10:52 PM
Something has to be done; the current solution does not work! I fell into the cracks of this system, not by any choice of my own. I started working full time under the table by the age of 12 while continuing going to school. By the time I was 18 I had 4 jobs and finally got my GED. Then I was lucky to get a federal job for the next 11 years living from place to place, until I was laid off due to automation. From there I was able to get a trade and work in the oil fields of Alberta. This is when everything fell apart. At the age of 34, I was diagnosed with a severe mental illness. Now I can’t get a job due to this previous medical condition. I can’t get life insurance. I can’t get any insurance of any kind, loans, etc. I always paid my taxes. I never collected unemployment, or welfare. AISH pays just over 1000 dollars a month. Try living on that while trying to get ahead. I know many people living on AISH that are stuck in never land. I again was fortunate to collect from a private medical insurance through my employers benefits. I get just over the 2000 dollar mark with no increases or raises. I have to pay for 10% of my medications which comes to 257.68 every month. I still find it difficult to live. Also there is a very real stigma associated with mental illness and being poor or on the streets. Having gone to many groups counselling etc I found out that a lot of the people on the streets are like me, but cant afford the outrageous price of medications to keep there illness in control, let alone get an apartment and try to find a job. I and many others continually have to prove we are still unfit to work to continue getting funds. Trust me, when you have a mental illness, and you have no medication, you are lucky to know who you are let alone be capable of making the appointment or filling out the endless paper work.
It is one continuous vicious circle.
Thanks Bonnie