Do public sector workers deserve all those sick days?
In the general parlance of coffee shop complainery, perhaps no group is as reviled as government workers, who are not so much inefficient but also loaf, whine and go home to cushy salaries and pensions.
Of course, painting all public workers this way is not just unfair. It’s inaccurate, too. Yet such are the broad strokes many use.
In most ways, it is easy to spin this stereotype. You could cite, say, the country’s many nurses, who bust their asses, saving lives and all for modest public wages.
But then a report comes out on the number of sick days public sector workers take versus their private sector counterparts, and now everyone’s seeing red again.
Certainly, if you don’t work in the public sector, you’ve heard tales of its workers’ sick days, which by rumour appear to be an entitlement, not a safety net.
*Bing: How much is Stephen Harper’s salary?
Though the rumours just may be true.
According to the Canadian Federation of Independent Business (CFIB), public sector workers in Canada take nearly five more sick, disability and personal days (referred to as “sick days” throughout this post) per year than those employed in the private sector.
Overall, public sector workers take 12.9 sick days per year. Private sector workers take just 8.2, on average.
Federal government employees enjoyed the most sick days, at 15.2 per year, reports the CFIB.
The report offers some interesting side points: among private sector companies, employees that work for businesses with fewer than 20 staff took 6.7 days off, while employees that work for businesses with more than 500 staff took 9.1 days off. That number’s still lower than the public sector figure, but it suggests that workers of smaller companies – where absences are more greatly noticed and accountability likely more rigidly enforced – most often slug it into work, no matter how they’re feeling.
Most glaring, though, is the discrepancy between sick days taken by public sector workers and those taken by private sector workers. According to the CFIB, the difference in those days – that is, the extra days taken by public sector workers – cost $3.5 billion each year, because many public sector workers can take a lump sum payment if they don’t use their allotted sick days.
“I don’t think anybody believes that public sector workers just get sick more often, yet something makes them feel entitled to more time off,” CFIB president and CEO Dan Kelly said.
“Obviously, we want to be compassionate when people are truly not well, but the current system has entrenched a feeling of entitlement of those days off that has very little to do with being sick.”
By Jason Buckland, MSN Money
Posted by: Alan I | Dec 11, 2021 3:03:38 AM
My, my another shot a public sector workers. They are such easy targets having been villified as lazy, do-nothings who simply lounge around the office, taking sick days and collecting fat pay cheques.
I am not defending the very small miniority who might choose to abuse a sick day policy, but then again, they are available in any and every sector. However, maybe a reality check might be helpful in gaining understanding into the world of a civil servant.
Generally speaking, the wages of a civil servant are much lower than most comparable positions in the private sector. We, how choose to work in public service, choose the career out of a sense of community responsiibility, an interest in government and/or a desire to serve. To balance out the poorer compensation, civil servants will not apologize for having access to good pension and benefit packages.
Let the public continue to complain about salaries, benefits and pensions of civil servants. Go ahead. Strip all of these benefits.The majoirty of current staff work very hard to ensure that you have access to the government services you require.Take all of this away, hire unqualified and even more unappreciated staff and see where the quality and level of service will take us as a province.
Posted by: Karl | Dec 11, 2021 5:26:55 AM
It's funny...I was just un Germany and was talking to a German whose favourite soccer team just suffered a crushing defeat. The players just didn't put in much effort that game...no heart...just going through the motions and playing porly. They were booed off the field. He said, "They were awful. They played like government workers today!" I loved the saying because it totally captures the essence of most (but not all) government workers. The professional soccer players are getting big bucks even if they don't try hard...it's kind of the same with bureaucrats.
Posted by: Edward Fleming | Dec 11, 2021 7:25:02 AM
Most workers have these policies dictated to them because they are forced to join unions in order to work. They have little say in negotiations, and personal merit counts for nothing under a collective bargaining agreement. Rather than have the media focus on a particular benefit, it would make more sense to deal with the larger issue of how to limit the power of public service unions to hold the public and the public purse to ransom.
Posted by: craig | Dec 11, 2021 7:40:27 AM
Alan is blind to the reality of private vs public sector workers. 12.9 days and a lump sum payment every year is almost 3 weeks pay, private companies dont bank hours, to the contrary. they had to create a labor law to allow private sector employees 10 'E days' without being fired for taking time off to look after sickness or family issues. Government employees have the nice pensions, the best benefits and the highest pay. Alan you are delusional .
Never mind go into a government office and see the pace at which they work, trust me, most people would be fired if they moved that slow. never mind there nice short days, 9-3 usually, if i'm not mistaken, that's 6 hours a day..Ever go to the beer store or liquor store and get there 5 minutes before they close, only to find the doors locked, the employees inside, totally ignoring you. Because they don't worry about profit or loss, and whats an extra sale to them
get real people, the government sector are spoiled and out of touch with reality
Posted by: Daniel | Dec 11, 2021 8:31:14 AM
Craig is right. A private sector employee earns less hourly than a public sector employee. So sure your salary is slightly less but you work significantly less hours to more than make up for it. Additionally, the loopholes the government must go through to fire an underachieving employee is staggering, so job security is much better. So yes you make less, but you also work less and take less risk.
Posted by: Julie | Dec 11, 2021 8:47:23 AM
Keep in mind people that most if not all public sector workers are union members and pay monetary dues to have such benefits available to and for them. Yes there are workers who are not breaking their backs but there are also lazy butt workers in the private sector as well. People in the private sector are more likely not a member of a union, nor are they having large amounts of their pay cheque with held to cover the cost of benefits and the like. Sure they are called "benefits" but people contribute to their benefits through their deductions. The benefits are not all provided free. The employees pay a contribution also and those deductions are with held from pay cheques. Honestly, yes I agree that people doing a similar job in the private sector do not have the same bells and whistles as a gov't employee has but they also probably do not have the same deductions, taxs, union dues, etc. If people want the gov't sector jobs, apply for one. There are lazy people in the work force in all areas, and we all have had the privelege or not of knowing such lazy co-workers in the all areas.
Merry Christmas everyone!!!
Posted by: another Allan but the one in reality and who works for a living. | Dec 11, 2021 8:55:33 AM
Let's take a vote? Who thinks Alan works for the gov't? I do I do...its a given!
Anyone with that much anger and angst is definately on the gravy train and like a ferret backed into a corner will defend his own skin to the very end. You are pathetic Alan and just who picks up the tab for the unproductive gov't sector? We private industry people. And another thing, we, normal regular working peoples will not in the long run pay for your unsustainable parachute pension and benefit packages. We simply can not and will not pay anymore, we are tapped out.
Posted by: another Allan but the one in reality and who works for a living. | Dec 11, 2021 9:02:37 AM
Julie, you also are dilusional. Lazy people in the private sector? yes..they are called the unemployed or recently fired for being lazy. You can't fire gov't people period or lazy union people that's the whole point!
Just because you pay a $100 union fee so you 'deserve' better bargaining right? Unions have pretty much destroyed Canada's once vibrant manu-base and if left unapposed would destroy the country by making it completely uncompetative.
Good grief you make a lousy argument.
Posted by: steve | Dec 11, 2021 9:09:06 AM
The argument for paid sick days is a negotiated part of a contract... a safety net that is in place for the worker, which they can aquire as a bonus for not missing days. So essentially its a bonus for showing up, or coverage for ill. Even a lame reason such as " the blahs" should be a day off, as you would ideally want to encourage a good psychology of workers at any site.
simply because the private sector slave drivers who get rich by contracting to compete, based upon lower wages, need to whip thier men to work when they may not be feeling "tiptop", is just another reason that non union employers are bad employers and stupid capitalists.
without the social systems and the easy money, most wanna-be capitalists would have no market. A true Capitalist encourages higher wages so that more people can buy their products. All of Society should be against the cheap-skate non union employers, as they dimminish the local economy and that creates lower sales.
So anyhow, Sick days as a performance bonus.... wish my contract had them.
Posted by: Kevin | Dec 11, 2021 10:02:58 AM
I have experience working in a lobster pound, salmon cages in the bay of fundy, I worked at IBM as a technical support person, and am now a programmer who was given a co-op role in the government for 6 months but was not extended to work there longer.
I've seen a lot of people in different environments using the 'system' in various ways.
First of all, people will use what they're given when it's there for them... so an employee got 15 days sick time this year? Great, their son is sick and needs care, they're sick, their wife needs someone to get her to the hospital.. with an alotment of available time, it gets used.
Companies who don't give that time create tremendous guilt if you need the time, doubly so if you need more sick time on top of what they gave you. It's not fun to feel guilty around coworkers all the time so you work when you're not feeling 100%. If a private sector employee was sick and had the time, they'd use it to.
Finally, if you're the type trying to find a way out of work all the time, you'll get away with as much as you can, regardless of where you're working. It's your ethic, bad or good.
I guess the ultimate point is that you take 200 people from the private sector, pop them into government roles and in 12 months times you won't be able to tell them apart.
Personally, if you're sick, i think you should stay home. Here's a great article that backs me up. http://www.businessweek.com/stories/2008-02-28/should-you-go-to-work-when-youre-sick-businessweek-business-news-stock-market-and-financial-advice
Sad that people have to think that private and public are two different species of human, it's the environment that changes and people just adapt.
Posted by: Ron | Dec 11, 2021 10:05:16 AM
In reading these comments it makes me nauses to listen to some of these people. Why in God`s name should the Government dish out 3 billion dollars for people at the end of there year because they can save their sick days. Granted people who are sick should by all means be compensated...Do you not realize we pay for this through our taxes...also passports, drivers lisecence and many other things we get through the Government to pay this 3 billion dollars. The gentlman that mentioned 100.00 Union dues, if people don`t Know they get it all back through their taxes.
Teachers for instance have rolling strikes,I would like to know how much a teacher makes for a year and the amount of time they get off in one year.
Posted by: Al Shadow | Dec 11, 2021 10:05:27 AM
Ok when I first started in the work force I had a choice private/public sector I took the public sector for obvious reasons (benefits) So all you find works in the private sectors you also had a choice so do not complain cause others you feel have a better deal. Sometimes the grass is not all that greener on the other side. Also if you work in the private sector why dont you get off your butts and group to together to make a union if you think they are so grand and get all those so called benefits you feel your deprived from. Make it happen, stop your complaining, get off your fat butts and make life better for you, your co-workers and your families like the public sectors have done. The general public believe that the public servants are lazy for various reasons. well I have to say I have seen some very lazy people in the private sector also, poorly trained most of the time, while at least the public servants are trained. So lets all stop complaining about the other side and just have a Merry Christmas with some hope that I too will have a job with benefits and someone will start a union to help me cause I am to lazy to cause I just like to complain cause that is what I do well at.
Posted by: cj | Dec 11, 2021 10:07:27 AM
I have a relative who says she gets paid time off,usually Fridays to do Christmas shopping.Also allowed to shop online while working.Nice!
Posted by: Kevin | Dec 11, 2021 10:12:56 AM
Another Allan - the one who is working for a living.
Thanks for paying our taxes and carrying the weight of Canada on your shoulders. We all owe you a debt of gratitude.
First of all, what's the race for and what's the prize? To be honest, there are many countries with relaxed people, doing relaxed work, that don't self-impose the levels of stress and work conditions we do to ourselves. When I retire, I don't want to think that I broke my legs, back, fingers for a carpentry company who doesn't pay enough to afford RRSP's and has no plan so I live off of OAS. My father is in that boat - broken body and nothing to show for it.
If everyone was unionized, yeah, the deadlines would be lengthened, the work would be equalized and this idea of last in - first out would be everywhere. Personally, it's terrible when a good worker has to go and a bad one stays... it's really terrible but a good worker will always be able to get another job. But what's worse is thinking that you should take poor workers and shuffle them off.. maybe we'll put them all in Newfoundland where they won't bother anyone.. and we'll keep the good employees to ourselves. Poor workers need more attention but can be just as capable with the right approach and attitude... and maybe a different role that suits them better. Who draws the line between good and bad anyway? You?
A final note, Allan. Who pays for ANY pension? RRSP's?? They're invested in markets.. where does the money in markets come from? Many times from the middle class who are trying to get ahead. Someone has to lose money for someone else to make it. Just because you can identify that every Canadian invests in the infrastructure of our Country doesn't mean that Joe.Investor isn't robbing thousands blind when he short sells on a company to make another 1% growth on his RRSP portfolio.
Posted by: Julie | Dec 11, 2021 10:20:30 AM
For the "Alan" who commented that I am dilusional and is obviously assuming I am a gov't employee??? Well, I am not, I work in the private sector and believe me there are lots of people who are lazy and yes the can and do get fired. Also in the private sector there are bosses who treat there employees like slaves. Fortunately I work for a great company and I have a very fair and decent boss. There are people who will abuse in all areas and walks of life. Hell how many people do we have sucking off the funds by sitting on their lazy asses on welfare and all the people that come to our country and live off our sicial programs and the like. Alan, you are basically saying that all lazy persons working in the private sector are unemplyed???? Hell, they must be all the lazy ass welfare recipients. ....... Honestly you seem extremely angry and you must be one of the many who fall into the unfortunate category of having a boss that treats you like a slave.
Posted by: Julie | Dec 11, 2021 10:26:12 AM
Also for the "Alan" who said I was dilusional. If you actually read my words, I said there are lazy people in ALL areas. Funny how you only saw what you wanted to
Posted by: Krys | Dec 11, 2021 10:54:32 AM
As a one of the "lazy" government workers that you refer to - I'd like to clear up a few things.
Yes, I do receive 15 paid sick days per year, but did you know:
When my Aunt died, I wasn't compensated for the day I had to take off work in order to attend her funeral, because it wasn't in my collective agreement; when I have a doctor's appointment, I'm forced to use time from my sick days because I'm not allowed to make up the hours; I do not have short-term disability - if I need to have surgery, I have to have banked sick time to use that will need to last me approximately 6 weeks before long-term disability kicks in, otherwise, I don't get paid.
Perhaps that is one of the reason's why public service workers use more sick days. We're forced to.
I worked in the private industry before coming to the public service, and I can assure you, there are pros and cons to each sector.
And as Julie mentioned, there were plenty of lazy people working with me in the private sector as well.
Posted by: Derek Elo | Dec 11, 2021 11:26:19 AM
I live in Ottawa and I work in the private sector. The fustration I see with the majority of Gov't workers is they only talk about what they get, sick days, pension, salaries, perks etc. I do not usually here what they do- I think 15 days is way too much sick time and is should reduced. Each person should be treated as a individual when it comes to sick time. People who abuse it should lose thier jobs.
I think club Fed should be stop and our gov't start working for the people again.
Posted by: Daniel | Dec 11, 2021 11:50:03 AM
I don't get short term disability either (Private sector) but I also can't bank my sick days. You have insurance to protect you for short term disability if you choose to enroll in it. Sick days aren't your short term disability insurance, they are a good will gesture from your employer not to go into work and make other people sick.
The difference is if you have a lazy private sector employee who isn't doing their job, than their ineffecient overhead is added to the cost of the product which is passed on the to the consumer, but the consumer has the CHOICE to pay extra for ineffeciencies.
We as taxpaying citizens do not have a choice not to pay taxes so ultimately your ineffeciency in the public sector is bourne by us the tax payers. We as tax payers get the raw deal in all of this and honestly, feel a little bit frustrated when the public sector doesn't realize how good they have it and ask us, the tax payers for more
Posted by: dave | Dec 11, 2021 12:16:21 PM
Any more than 4 days per year, 1 per quarter is excessive and should never be negotiated in any public sector contract.
If you are sick more than that, you should get fully checked out by your GP, as there is seriously something wrong with you.
The problem we have today is there is a huge lack of work ethic because of all the hand-outs. These have to go away, as it only adds to increases in taxes in stead of reduction that could be possible and reduction in productivity.
I have been in the workfore for over 38 years and have not had 8 sick days off work in that total time. Fortune, "yes", but also a strong work ethis that difficult to find today.
Posted by: George | Dec 11, 2021 12:39:23 PM
Bottom line, we the people is government. Public or private worker are all contributing to the taxes. In my opinion, no one should get paid for sick days if they are not taken. Its not good moral values if one wants to get paid sick days if they didnt take any for a year. Besides all public workers should be paid the same regardless of position. Give them all minimum wage for the lack of work they do :)
Posted by: cross2bear | Dec 11, 2021 12:44:34 PM
Oh for Petes sake - what do you think? Government workers DONT pay taxes? Of course they do! And probably at a higher rate than private sector workers because their salaries are public knowledge and there is no way to fudge it! Private sector workers probably take as much time off sick as public sector, but they are able to cut deals with bosses to not bother reporting it, or they make up time at another time. There are no gratuities to hide, no hidden perks like discounts on clothing, food or other merchandise that arent counted in salary quotes. Private sector workers are no better (or worse) than government workers when it comes to effort on the job - sales people on the phone with their significant others while I stand at a counter waiting for service. Kwitcherbitchin!
Posted by: Kila | Dec 11, 2021 1:09:19 PM
Yes, I will admit that I worked for the public sector, paid union dues and was entitled to sick days every month. The hours you earned towards sick time was 9.375 hours per month. If you have an ongoing condition, such as a heart attack, stroke or other condition and required ongoing medical appointments, those appointments were considered to be taken as sick time, not appoitment time. Even if a woman is pregnant and sees her doctor for pre-natal care, that too is considerd appointment time rather than sick time. I can see where people think public sector employees take alot of sick time, but when having to use sick time for appointment time, it adds up.
I will say that some employees use sick time for a "mental health day" just because they feel they need a day off even if they are not sick, just as private sector employees do.
Posted by: Brenda Haines | Dec 11, 2021 1:20:36 PM
I am a public sector worker and have been for the last 14 years. So far this year I've taken 1 sick day. We don't get paid a lump sum for sick days not used. If I finish work next week, that's it, any sick time that I've accumulated is gone. However, if I do get sick and need extra time off to get better it's there. But if that accumulated time runs out, then you are on unpaid leave. There are a lot of people who abuse sick time, but not everyone. I know one person who was receiving radiation therapy. She would go to work in the morning and go for radiation in the afternoon. There arn't many private sector workers who would do that. And don't worry, no public sector worker ever became a millionaire collecting their pension. We don't get any Christmas bonus, not even a turkey. Our christmas dinner was finally reinstated after many years. And don't get upset, none of us will tip the scales after eating it. It's lovely and I appreciate it but people get the wrong idea about that as well. Afterall, we're not eating T-bone steaks. It's funny how much people "think" they know. I didn't dhose to be in a union. I don't have a choice. Also I would like to add that when I see how much gets deducted from my paycheque every two weeks to keep those people at home who have never worked and have no intention of working I could throw up. At least I feel that I am making a positive conribution to society. So there!!!!!
Brenda
Posted by: brad | Dec 11, 2021 1:39:40 PM
my wifes a nurse in bc ...11.5 sick days a year big deal.....she works about 5 extra shifts a month.cause there short of nurses
Posted by: Donovan | Dec 11, 2021 1:51:35 PM
The article failed to mention how stressful it is to deal with the public, as a public servant,...a public who really do little but complain and demand services because they "pay taxes". We all pay taxes!!! We all support each other. It's called an economy. Look it up. If you work at Tim's or Walmart or Coke or IBM or Rogers or a big bank...guess what? I pay for your salary, too. Without customers you are dead. But It's not like I have much of a choice of where to shop even. Why aren't your products cheaper? Why are you making my life and my family's life harder? Why am I paying your salry and benefits when I buy a coffee?
We all have a choice where we work. If you want a so-called "cushy" government job, then go out and get trained. The public service IS highly trained and we have to work on the up and up all the time. But I have a feeling you will run back to your cushy private sector jobs with your two hour lunches and parties and award ceremonies to make yourself feel good about yourself. The private sector rewards employees who can get ahead at any cost and cut tons of corners and laws in the name of efficiency. You are all so phoney to each other, too. Zero sense of loyalty to your companies or each other. Seems like you are all "putting-in-time" too. Least I can say that everyone I work with values each other because we all know the challenges we face daily amid a very negative media.
Next time you see a nurse ,or fireman, or EMS worker, or TTC operator, say "Thank you." Trust us...you have zero idea what you are talking about if you consider us lazy haha. Comes down to jealousy for doing a thank-less job and a highly stressful job...and maybe we get sick more because there is zero fun in our jobs because of you complainers out there. Next time I visit one of your places of work I'm going to demand excpetional service because I AM PAYING FOR YOUR SALARY, TOO!!!
P.S. we pay a ton for our pensions. its not free lol.
Posted by: Louise | Dec 11, 2021 1:53:47 PM
My God, the absolute crazy ignorance of some people!!! First: Unless you are a PART TIME governement employee (to which you are NOT receiveing the benefits that are being discussed here) you are working a 7.5 hour work work day. That is a full time government employee requirement. 7.5 hours per day, 37.5 hours per week. We too pay taxes, off our salaries just everyone else in the working world!
To the individual who wondered what the governemnt employees do, there is good news for you because you are about to find out! The government has essentially fired several hundreds of thousands of government employees therefore services to the public, IE: tax credit cheques, E.I payments, Health Canada (disease control etc.), services counters where you can collect T4's, change addresses, name, marital status to get your refunds quicker etc. etc. will all be affected. Taxes will rise because the people who do not remit their taxes or businesses who like to keep the GST/HST they collect, will take longer to track down because the resources are lower, etc. etc. etc.
There was a time when an outside consulting company compared a similiar AUDIT job with an Auditor in the private sector and an Auditor in the public service. The findings were that though public service employees made, SLIGHTLY more considering benefits, income and pension, the workload was SIGNIFICANT in it's difference. The average private sector auditor was found to be working on a file case load of approximately 2 dozen files at any given time vs. a public service employee whose running caseload in MOST cases exceeded 100 cases per worker with many closer to 200. Further, it established that Private sector workers have the benefit of bonuses, paid for business lunches/dinners etc., employer paid for Christmas parties with alcohol, dinner and dancing all of which are forbidden in the public service. It also concluded that even in tough times private sector workers saw, at the very least, cost of living salary raises vs. more then a half a dozen CONSECUTIVE years of wage FREEZES (0 percent) increases with the public service.
For those interested in the TRUE matter of public vs. private, these are the FACTS as they ARE. (not how the few uninformed see them.)
Posted by: Cindy | Dec 11, 2021 1:57:54 PM
I have been in the public sector for 35+ years. I have NEVER been paid for any sick days not taken, it is not in our collective agreement either but I know people in the private sector who do get paid out at the end of the year for un-used sick days! We DO NOT get a bonus- those who are unionized, but opted out and management do get a bonus, as do a lot of private sector workers. We have put up with the nasty talk about us doing nothing all day, getting big pay cheques when, in reality, it is very hard for the public sector to hire into positions because of the low salaries being offered. That is a fact! Please consider us as normal working stiffs, working where hiring freezes are a constant therefore making each worker doing the job of a minimum of 2 staff members or FTE's. After 35+ years in government, my pension is $1,600 a month !!!!! and your jealous !!!! Don't just repeat what others are saying, do some research first, we are not BETTER off but yes, we have a wonderful benefit package that is provided for with our Pension Dues taken each month, the deductions are incredible...paycheques can amount to very little compared to what is taken away from us......check it out for yourself and lets leave public servants alone.
Posted by: Len | Dec 11, 2021 2:13:26 PM
No federal government gets paid out for sick days that a lie whoever said they do are lying
Posted by: Truman | Dec 11, 2021 2:47:09 PM
Reality has left the building with a lot of public servants. This does not include front line health-care workers. For anyone to suggest that public servants are paid less than private sector workers is categorically false. Private sector comepensation has stagnated for the past decade while public servants have steadily increased their overall salaries & benefits. On average, when you count the sick leave, indexed pension & health care, the average federal employee makes about 40% more than his/her private sector counterparts. The people working in the private sector pay for this. I paid very high taxes during some high earning years when I would have liked to shelter the money in an RRSP. Unfortunately the rules don't allow you to save more than 18% of your total earned income so the rest got taxed away. Even the heads of government unions have stopped trying to explain away the discrepancy between what their members make versus the private sector. Their new line is that the Federal government should be mandating that private sector wages have to increase. This shows a complete ignorance of how the private sector works. When you have competition, you cannot afford to have your labour costs go up more than your profits. When you work in the government, there is no competition and little incentive to improve. Canada will go the way of Europe if we're not careful. All of the countries that are in big trouble now (Greece, Italy & Spain) are the ones with the biggest entitlements for their workers. Unions keep askling for moire, they don't consider or care what the overall state of the economy is. Ontario is now worse off than California ($20,000 of debt for every citizen versus $12,000 in California) yet government & teachers unions still want more.