HST fallout: Does anybody really care anymore?
We’re almost three months into Ontario’s new 13% harmonized sales tax and consumers are still confused about the rules.
Many are complaining about being nickel and dimed to death when it comes to applying the tax on certain items inappropriately or, in other cases, finding out that they’re not saving nearly as much as they thought when using coupons.
Others claim that the HST is taking a bite out of tourism and that real estate sales are also drying up as a result. Even though existing homes aren’t affected, many buyers rushed to buy them under the mistaken impression that HST applied, thus helping to push up prices.
And then there's the jump in the size of those monthly hydro bills and, of course, the price of gas.
How are you faring? Have you figured out what now costs more, which products haven't been affected and which ones are still exempt?
Some products are eligible for a point of-sale rebate for the provincial part of the HST. This means you'll only pay the 5% federal portion of the HST (equivalent to the current GST). These include print newspapers, books, diapers, children’s clothing and footwear, children’s car seats and booster seats, feminine hygiene products and diapers.
Many household expenses that weren’t subject to the PST are now included under the HST, however. These include: basic cable TV, local residential phone, landscaping, lawn care, private snow removal, home renovations, and service calls from electrician and plumbers.
Still puzzled or simply irritated? HST Ontario is a forum that offers taxpayers the opportunity to share their thoughts about this highly criticized tax.
Traffic and posts have slowed significantly, however – which begs the question: Why has a tax that caused such uproar in British Columbia received just a whimper in Ontario?
After almost 3 months is the HST still a hot topic? Are you talking about it with your friends? Do you care?
By Gordon Powers, MSN Money
Posted by: P Dunville | Sep 28, 2021 8:05:04 AM
Get an education there people. Being overweight can be costly,the issue is actually the effects of being overwieght..........sore backs,knees,diabetes ect. Alote of these things are also genetically inherited.Somepeople cant control being over weight.some people are emotional eaters or going through depression,or dont know how to make healthy choices. Food is also an addiction to some(It dosent mean poor people are fat,I know lots of rich fat people or fat people are lazy,and fat clothes are more expensive for the record because they use more material) If the medical field is so concerned with paying for additional cost related to obesity then they should assist poeple with thier weight loss by educating and giving them a diet plan, if they are a morbidly obese person they should pay for gastric bypass or lap bands(1 time) which is about 5,000.One time done,in day surgery.No more additional costs,meds or ongoing related illness.Pejudice and ignorance against people who are overwieght still exists, so instead of helping, its usually docters and people who say ,you made yourself this way ,now deal with it. What are the costs of other rehab or self help medical facilities all paid for bu govt...alcoholics drug users get free healthcare dont forget????????Did they not cause thier own problem?????????
Posted by: Cheryl Prattis | Sep 29, 2021 12:55:19 AM
Yes, I am very much upset at the HST, and many more issues, but I'm more upset at the shamelessly, whimpy, gutless, cowering Canadians that allow the Government & Bureaucrats, etc. to be their dictators. What we need is a rebellion & untill then Canadains will willing be drained dry and snowed over.
Posted by: ron bell | Sep 29, 2021 1:06:07 AM
Damn rights I'm still upset about the HST! At least B.C.ers are trying to do something about it, Ontario is doing nothing about it, or don't seem to care. Once more the liars in this gov't have ramroded something down peoples throats that they promised they wouldn't. I think it is about time for some political cleansing !!
Posted by: g. shortell | Sep 29, 2021 3:09:35 AM
Mr.McGuinty( Liberal) has stuck it to Ontarians & they deserve it. I did send an email to my local prov. conservative member opposing the Hst. At the very least remove the Hst from heating fuel & gasoline. This is Canada. Its cold in winter. Also most families have two vehicles since both parties work taking a further bite out of take home pay. For me, I couldn't believe golfing fees increased. And people thought Mike Harris (conservative) was a loser. He didn't rip U like the Liberals. Pay up folks!!!!! While your at it take a look at your Hydro bill.
Posted by: WALTER | Sep 29, 2021 5:30:17 AM
I'M VERY UPSET AT IT ABOUT IT, SPECIALLY BECAUSE OF BASIC NEEDS LIKE HEATING, ELECTRICITY AND GASOLINE WHICH WE ALREADY ARE PAYING PROVINCIAL TAXES. CUSTOM TAXES 13%? SO, WHEN YOU GO ACROSS THE BORDER FOR SHOPPING AND COMEBACK, YOU'RE PAYING PROVINCIAL TAXES FOR SOMETHING YOU DIDN'T BUY IN THE PROVINCE. POP? FAST FOOD OVER $4? MC GUINTY BELIEVE THAT WE ARE IDIOTS, YES, WE ARE IDIOTS FOR ACCEPTING IT, AND MORE IDIOTS ARE THE PEOPLE WHOM ARE THINKING ON RE-ELECT HIM AGAIN, B.C. IS PROTESTING ABOUT IT, AND THEY''LL WIN THAT REFERENDUM AND LIBERALS WON'T WIN NEXT ELECTION UNLESS THEY CORRECT AND ELIMINATE HST, BUT AS USUAL WE ONTARIANS, WAIT FOR THE RESULTS IN OTHER PROVINCE SO WE CAN ACT. WE DON'T CARE? OF COURSE WE CARE, BUT THIS PROVINCE IS FULL OF IMMIGRANTS, SPECIALLY THE IMMIGRANTS ON WELFARE WHOM ARE IGNORANT ABOUT THIS ISSUE. 'WE ARE MINORITY', ALSO, I HAVEN'T SEEN THE FIRST ONTARIAN GOING TO THE STREETS TO PROTEST OR COLLECT SIGNATURES IN ORDER TO REPEAL THIS TAX THAT HYPER INFLATED AND SLOWED DOWN THE ECONOMIES OF THE MAIN AND MORE PROSPEROUS PROVINCES OF CANADA. WE DIDN'T VOTE FOR THIS!
Posted by: scott | Sep 29, 2021 7:02:42 AM
the hst opinion page, where we can have our say, isn't even operational yet on the website you post the link for,i also wrote my local mp and got a call back from his office saying thank you for your concern, you are not the only person upset with the hst tax.
Posted by: Darryl | Sep 29, 2021 7:21:42 AM
Well well well.... it's inevitible...Prices always rise, and that includes more tax. Any way they can get more money. But you know something?? In NS, we've been paying HST on basic needs for a LOOONNNG time, and it recently when up to 15%. So stop whining.
The only fairness is to make it the same across Canada.
Posted by: Anonymous | Sep 29, 2021 8:34:19 AM
When I heard that replacing my furnace resulted in double HST (the retailer gets charged full HST from the supplier, thus pushing up the price they have to charge the customer) and then the retailer has to charge the customer full HST as well, I was floored.
Why do we have to pay double HST? The price of the same furnace is about 20% more now than before HST.
As a disabled person who cannot work, all of the newly increased prices due to HST (e.g. utilities, auto fuel, etc.) are killing me financially. It's bad enough I'm having to endure months of red tape to get disability benefits while we lose everything we own waiting to see if I'm approved. Adding HST is just accelerating our road to bankruptcy. Why do I feel punished for being disabled??????
Signed: Overtaxed and frustrated....
Posted by: david park | Sep 29, 2021 8:40:11 AM
i was wondering if it is on home insurance my insurance went up about that mutch it seems insurance companys dont stick to the cost off living dosent someone regulate them im,m a pensoner and my income never went up to compensate for such things?
Posted by: NecktopPC | Sep 29, 2021 8:44:26 AM
I am extremely proud, and encouraged, by the determined hard work of Bill Vander Zalm and, fellow "Fight HST" organizer; Chris Delaney...not forgetting any of the many peoples of Vancouver, that objected (signing the Petition...so did I) to another of HER [QEII] SOCIETIES TAX [HST] GRABS.
Now...if only the folks in Nova Scotia and Ontario would to join this fight...we the people rule...power to the people!!
Posted by: Skipper | Sep 29, 2021 9:00:24 AM
You don't pay HST twice as one of the previous comments suggest. (re: furnace install) If you think you did, you got suckered my friend. These companies claim Input Tax Credits for the HST they paid. If they passed it on to you by chance, you got ripped!. I do however understand what you're saying...this entire HST thing is a rip, yet we elect these FRAUDS. Oh sorry, government screw-ups are referred to as BAD MANAGEMENT..ordinary people do it and its fraud!. Here's a small TIP regarding tax - on items under $4.00 - if two or more of you buy say a Tim's coffee and perhaps a pastry, get the cashier to ring them in separately, not together. Together they total MORE than $4.00 and you are taxed on that total. Separately you don't. My wife and I do this all the time. We order and pay separately. However, not much you can get for under $4 anymore.
Posted by: martin | Sep 29, 2021 2:38:24 PM
My wife and I used to go out to restaurants quite a bit.
In B.C. with the new added tax, plus the new impaired driving laws
being zero tolerance,( I wouldn't risk even a glass of wine). I am against drinking and driving. I did not realize that with the new law,.. even with a glass of wine I could be impaired.
We have stopped going out and just stay home ,Instead , we now have neighbors over more often. They too, have adjusted to the new taxes and laws. it's become the talk of the neighborhood.
It's actually pretty enjoyable. and ,,.. my wife and I have saved over $1200.00 by not going to restaurants in the last 2 months! Wow! With Both the HST and new driving restrictions ,cabs etc we have most defiantly saved quite a bit! Never mind what ours neighbors have. We are well off but, being retired my wife and I will probably save another $10,000 this year alone in just restaurant expenses. In just our neighborhood probably $30,000?? Incredible! I enjoy it It's great for the pocket book and,... we also have gotten to know our neighbors ! Even people with less than we do could start doing this. You would save so much money!!It's also quite a bit of fun!
Posted by: Albertan | Sep 29, 2021 3:09:26 PM
Ok, lets clear up the many items misconstrued above.
Delusion one: We should share HST to everybody in the county.
GST was 5% and PST was 7% in B.C. (good example to use) while Alberta just has 5% GST with 0% PST. Now B.C has 12% HST with 5% going to the federal government and 7% to the provincial government. Alberta still only has 5% GST because our provincial government doesn't require a sales tax to raise enough funds. So blame your provincial leader for the tax and not federal and don't try to share the cost to other provinces as the extre amount is strictly for the province you are in. Alberta already pays transfer payments to the other provinces to help pay for them.
Deulusion two: We are paying much more tax than before.
The amount paid by society on a whole should stay roughly the same (its called tax neutral). All the 7% of HST collected in British Columbia should about equal the 7% of PST no longer paid. This is because while many items didn't have PST before (heat, fuel, new homes etc.) many consumable items would have had PST added several times (ie. items bought and sold several times in a manufacturing process would have had PST added multuple times). These two differences as HST applies to more items but is only charged once on an item cause about the same amount of net tax to be recovered. The big difference is that instead of having a federal GST system and a separate Provincial PST system they are instead combined into one saving admininstration costs and filing costs. The net impact therefore is the same tax collected with less effort and cost meaning more tax dollars for government programs.
Really the hatred of this tax is mostly along ideological lines and misunderstanding. Traditionally High income individuals pay a huge tax on income while low income individuals pay very little. This consumption based tax works out more evenly as people pay tax on their consumption rates which don't alter drastically from low income to high income. Basically speaking with income tax a high income person probably pays 20X-30X more in tax than a low income person while with a consumption tax they only pay 3X-5X more as low income people consume a much higher percentage of their income. Really HST has further spread the tax burden a little more than PST to all members of society instead of concentrating it agianst the few high income individuals. PST also negatively punishes manufacturing in the province where it occurs thus hurting businesses which are what employ people.
I am a tax specialist with 9 years of post secondary that pays over 60K a year in tax while only being 29. My daily work involves assiting individuals to pay to the legally least amount of tax possible making me very familiar with our entire tax system. I don't begrudge the tax that I pay (it is already 4X the average and rising fast) but I do find it ironic that most of the people resenting this tax pay little to no taxes and are just now being held accountable for a fraction of what they cost the system.
In conclusion I am saying HST is a good idea and that it means that a portion of tax will be a little more evenly distributed based on consumption instead of based on income and it will only tax society the same amount as PST but cost much less to administer.
Posted by: Jack | Oct 2, 2021 12:48:33 AM
I certainly do not care about the HST. Never have, never will. I already pay a huge amount of taxes (almost $100,000 in income tax, $20,000 in property tax, and who know how much in sales tax). Do I care? NO! I still consider myself lucky to live in this country. I can go for a walk without worrying about being shot or stepping on an IED. I believe our health care (though not perfect) is still great. When I have a medical emergency, I get instant service. We have freedom. We are truly spoiled. When I travel to foreign countries on business (about 75% of my time), the most common comment I hear about Canadians is they are the biggest bunch of whiners on the plant.
Posted by: Halowiscious | Oct 3, 2021 1:07:20 AM
Jack is an idiot.
Posted by: Halowiscious | Oct 3, 2021 1:08:38 AM
Martin and his wife are basically thrifty drunk drivers.
Posted by: Halowiscious | Oct 3, 2021 1:33:01 AM
Fight the HST!!! I run a restaurant in a small town. I really don't like charging the extra tax to my customers. In my line of business, I only had to pay the 5% G.S.T. That wasn't much of a problem, but seriously, the H.S.T. appears to be against the restaurant businesses in B.C. Now, with HST which is the GST and the HST combined, I have to charge 12% taxes. I seem to be working more for the government than myself. I have to send over $6000 to the government every three months. This does not make any sense to me, and I should be getting a percentage of that back because basically I am raping my customers on the government's behalf. It's like using my worst enemy's penis to have sex with my wife. The funny thing is that I do not pay the taxes for my stock, but I have to charge it to my customers. I have no choice in the matter. If I was selling nuts and bolts, I would at least be getting the HST I paid back after my tax year. Now what kind of sense does that make? None. The tax benefits no one. The tax should be scrapped. I signed the petition. You losers in the East are all sheep. There was an idiot who wasted his time to type a long winded post about how he could care less about the HST and then went on and on about how much he pays on his freaking property taxes, etc. What did I say about a frog in a boiling pot of water?
Posted by: Halowiscious | Oct 3, 2021 1:35:56 AM
Oh yeah, it's why I called Jack an idiot, and I deleted the part about the frog, but it's not hard to figure out the boiling frog story. They have no idea the temerature is rising until they are too dead to take notice of their doom.
Posted by: martin | Oct 5, 2021 10:35:38 AM
Halowiscious does not read very well. Martin and his wife
are against drinking and driving!
As for the tax accountant.
In B.C , a $2500 invoice from an accountant is now $175.00 more with HST.
A $250 .00 bill at a restaurant is now $17.50 more with HST.
Any products purchased from a large retail chain, Pick any . A $1000.00 TV
for example is the same price in every province. Only the tax differs.
If I bought the T.V in Alberta I would pay $50.00 in tax. In B.C, I would pay
$120.in tax for the identical T.V. Consumers in B.C. pay more for identical products. The difference after implementing the HST is B.C. consumers must now pay more for identical "services" than before. I.E Restaurants. hair cuts, accounting services, the list goes on. Simply put , We pay more unless, you are telling me since the implementation of the HST,.. Accountants in B.C charge 7% less on their fees than they did last year.
Posted by: David Ramsay | Oct 6, 2021 7:21:21 PM
BC premier Gordon Campbell is a dictator, should we let this keep happening? It is not only about the HST, it is also about our democratic system which I believed we never had in Canada. As all politicians can do and will do whatever they think is right for us.
Gordon Campbell is big liar and should be removed by all means. All other liberals should be removed too as they supported their dictator. They only vote for the party not for the people and they should all go to hell!!